UPDATED- The limits of human stupidity: Divorce and Minivans

"shop-teacher" (shop-teacher)
01/15/2016 at 12:00 • Filed to: Car Buying

This was tangentially related to the story about !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , because the minivan in question was leased at Napleton Kia in Elgin. I linked it there in a comment, and have been getting more questions and comments about the story, so I thought I would update you all about the whole “sticky” (ewwwww) situation.

Jimmy indeed got divorced from “Satan’s idiot spawn” back in March (I liked that term enough to quote myself). He didn’t actually move out until October, but he is now free at last, free at last! Of course he still has regular contact with her, because kids. As of Jimmy’s move-out date, seven whole months into a 42 month lease, the van had over 10k miles on it, a series of large black scuffs on top of the hood (how did THOSE get there????), and the interior is thoroughly trashed. I’m setting the under/over on damage and mileage overage charges at lease turn-in at $5000.

A couple of personal notes about SIS. She has been spending her free time largely on cat-fishing dudes to try and get money out of them. She also recently took out a $10,000 loan at 31% interest. She showed Jimmy the paperwork. The payoff price for the loan ... $27,000!!!!

The hits just keep on comin’!

For those of you that missed the original story back in March. Enjoy, and be thankful you are smarter than this woman.

This Friday will be a day of hope for our family. After an incredibly long and drawn out process that has been years in the making, my brother-in-law will finally be divorced from Satan’s idiot spawn. For the purposes of this article, we’ll call him Jimmy. A brief bit of background, his wife gave birth to four children while they were married. The older two were Jimmy’s, I’ll let you figure out the rest from there.

If I knew you personally, I could regale you for hours on end with tales of insanely stupid things she has said or done. If I was writing a book, I could fill an entire chapter with horrible, lame excuses for where she was, when she was really out cheating. This place being about cars, let me communicate how impossibly dumb she is, by telling you about her most recent car purchase.

The financial situation, as you might imagine, is bleak. It is particularly bleak for her. The house will be foreclosed on, she makes crap money, and now she has to support the two younger kids on her own, with everything that entails. She works at a bank, and yet she has racked up credit card after credit card, paying only minimums. As part of the divorce settlement, she got their minivan, a 2008 Toyota Sienna. The Sienna was a year from being paid off, had an additional year of extended warranty, and had nothing wrong with it (except a filthy interior, of course).

So, what is one with four kids, no money, an impending financial crisis, and only one asset in the world (a reliable and nearly paid-off minivan) to do? Get a new minivan, of course. Saturday night she went out and traded the Sienna in on a new Kia Sedona.

Let me lay out the deal for you, as relayed by Jimmy via text:
- Sticker price of the van, $32k
- Down payment, $0
- Trade-in value of ‘08 Sienna, -$8,900
- Payoff ‘08 Sienna, ~$4800
- Misc. added on fees, $1200 (actual title and license fees in our state are around $250)
- Pre-payed maintenance package, $650
- RUST-PROOFING, $750
- LEASE ACQUISITION FEE, $500
- Lease payment, $355/month for 42 months
- Lease termination fee, $400

You read that right. She bought rust-proofing on a car she was leasing!

When Jimmy (who is in the IDGAF stage) found out she had leased the van, he bluntly asked her, “So, what are you going to do in three years?” He, of course, got no response. She doesn’t think three minutes ahead, let alone three years.

DISCUSSION (100)

shitheelandtoe > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:10

Are the other two kids from the car salesman? Coz I think she got screwed by him.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:11

What a piece of work. Makes me feel bad for the kids, though.

Hiroku > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:12

How does one go about marrying such a creature and impregnating it with two poor little humans?

505Turbeaux > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:14

christ, that is a bad decision. When my mom divorced my dad, and he deserved it for sure, she made a good play. Took my dads '86 black 911 cabrio and left him with the 268K mile Grand Voyager.

shop-teacher > 505Turbeaux
03/02/2015 at 09:15

She's made bad decisions her life's work. Your mom sounds about a billion times smarter.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:16

"She works at is a sperm bank"

shop-teacher > Snuze: Needs another Swede
03/02/2015 at 09:16

The kids are the true victims in all of this. Nobody will suffer more than them.

Tohru > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:17

Well if you're going to be living in your van down by the river, might as well live in a new van.

505Turbeaux > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:18

yeah, she knew how and when to use it

shop-teacher > Hiroku
03/02/2015 at 09:19

One has to have a true commitment to avoiding all warning signs. For example, she pitched a fit because the engagement ring didn't have a big enough diamond. So, he took it back and bought a bigger one, that he couldn't really afford. And so the cycle would continue ...

shop-teacher > Tohru
03/02/2015 at 09:21

I don't ever want to think about how bad that would smell!

shop-teacher > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell.
03/02/2015 at 09:22

That's a much nicer term than the one my wife and I use to refer to her.

Tohru > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:24

Like a can of tuna fish in a truck stop bathroom.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:24

That is impressively stupid.

And like you said in other responses, it's the kids who suffer, and that really sucks.

I've always said don't bring kids into it until it's 100% not going anywhere. I know nothing is ever 100%, but you gotta sit down and make sure it's as close as possible for 100%

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > 505Turbeaux
03/02/2015 at 09:24

Okay. Now where's the 911?

shop-teacher > Tohru
03/02/2015 at 09:25

I bet it would be a lot worse. I've seen how dirty it is just driving it around.

jariten1781 > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:26

Won't matter....those type of parasites will have another meal ticket lined up before everything comes crashing down....and since they have no shame they'll have no problem just stopping payments, letting it be repo'd and having the debt washed in bankruptcy if it gets dicy in the meantime. They're the worst.

505Turbeaux > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
03/02/2015 at 09:26

my mom sold it the day she got the title. No freaking clue. I told her to keep it for me till I was old enough, she laughed

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
03/02/2015 at 09:28

She's all-in on the stupid. She compounds it with an air of false superiority.

It was 100% not going anywhere three years ago. The kids, especially the young ones, have suffered a lot though this unbearably long and unstable time. Not to mention the stress has aged Jimmy about 15 years in the last three. He's going to drop dead any time now, if he doesn't get out of there.

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:29

Oh god you should have heard the terms thrown around when a friend got cheated on (he heard them in the act). These offensive terms eventually drove him to not be friends with us anymore because he got back together with the girl after 2 days.

Some people are really excellent at ignoring massive warning signs.

bob and john > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:30

Kinja'd!!!

WOW.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > 505Turbeaux
03/02/2015 at 09:32

I AM VERY EXTREMELY DISAPPOINT (-_-)

Snuze: Needs another Swede > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:33

Absolutely. Especially with having a *crazy* mom. I think I'm an odd case in that not only are my parents still together, but a lot of my friends parents are too. But of the people I do know (friends, co-workers, etc.) whose parents did divorce I've noticed that some take it really well, some don't. I rarely know the specifics, but it seems like when it just wasn't working out between the parents, any strife they did have they kept behind closed doors, and they managed to remain at least cordial after the split, the kids wind up relatively normal. But when shit gets crazy and the kids end up getting bounced back and forth after the split between two parents who just use them as *tools* to get their digs in at their former spouse, they end up pretty screwed up as adults. I hope that Jimmy is willing and able to at least take care of his kids and isolate them as much as legally possible from their mother.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:33

All I could think about while reading your story is of an older GMC Jimmy with some wear and tear, but still chugging. Still keeping an upbeat attitude.

"Things are looking up for ol' Jimmy!"

Kinja'd!!!

505Turbeaux > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
03/02/2015 at 09:33

yeah, me too

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:35

Man that's brutal.

I'm sure as a community, if there's anything OPPO can do, we'd all be happy to.

And it always seems like the superiority follows the stupid around doesn't it?

yamahog > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:36

Woof. Still better decision-making skills than my mom... Broke and bought a used SLK350 convertible while still owning a paid-off, decently maintained MKX and a paid-off piece of shit Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder that she now expects my 17-year-old sister to repair and maintain with zero automotive repair experience or education. Mom used to do her own maintenance, but that has long since fallen by the wayside, and she never taught the little one anything. She's a smart girl (salutatorian and everything) but her father is useless and luckily never tried to teach her car stuff because he doesn't know anything.

Surprise, surprise: fuel pump on the Mitsubishi goes, leaves my sister stranded 25 miles from home on a school night, mom has the gall to call me at 10pm asking for me to pay for a tow truck (I live 10 hours away for a reason) and repair while berating my sister for not magically knowing the fuel pump was on the way out and fixing it on her cashier's pay check. Pretty rich coming from someone who drove the Lincoln on noisy, obviously shot wheel bearings for months until I visited and told her to get it fixed.

Luckily for your brother-in-law, he's getting a divorce. Sounds like with time, it'll be for the best for all involved. I'm stuck with this nonsense.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > 505Turbeaux
03/02/2015 at 09:39

if it were me, I would like, not speak to her for at least a month in that situation. No amount of mommy cookies could fix that. :p

XJDano > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:40

Is she hot?

I mean at least good looking like above a 7?

505Turbeaux > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
03/02/2015 at 09:41

Yeah, I didn't talk to her for 3 years somewhere around that point, not only for that reason though...tough times.

shop-teacher > XJDano
03/02/2015 at 09:41

NO!

But she's willing to do just about anything, with just about anybody.

shop-teacher > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner
03/02/2015 at 09:43

Thank you! Things are finally looking up. Nobody can really help Jimmy but himself at this point. I mean, we're here to support him, but the actions have to come from him.

It is funny how stupidity and superiority go hand-in-hand.

shop-teacher > Snuze: Needs another Swede
03/02/2015 at 09:46

It is going to be hard, but splitting is by far the best of two bad situations for the kids. Jimmy will do everything in his power to deprogram them. Providing for his two kids, won't be a problem for him, either. He has a good job.

Brickman > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:46

All the more reason to have a car family. But they do drain your money and cause mental breakdowns and car breakdowns :)

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > 505Turbeaux
03/02/2015 at 09:46

Orly?? I was being too lenient then. I'd lock her up in a room with a golden girls marathon and days of our lives as the only means of entertainment for 3 months.

Coty > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:47

You read that right. She bought rust-proofing on a car she was leasing!

If you need me I'll be on the floor of my sales office, making laughing facial expressions but no noise.

I wish I cared little enough to do this to people.

shop-teacher > yamahog
03/02/2015 at 09:49

Oooffff! I feel especially bad for your sister!.

The divorce is absolutely the best thing for everybody. There is no good scenario, but this is the best of all options.

shop-teacher > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles
03/02/2015 at 09:49

Ha! That's actually not a bad analogy :)

shop-teacher > Coty
03/02/2015 at 09:50

I imagine many beers were bought, after she walked out the door.

NotUnlessRoundIsFunny > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:51

She's all-in on the stupid.

It's a terrible situation, especially for the kids (really), but I have to thank you for a great new catchphrase. :-)

Coty > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:53

This is worse than anything I've ever seen come through my dealership. Dear god.

Party_in_the_USA > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:55

Those poor kids.

shop-teacher > jariten1781
03/02/2015 at 09:55

They are the worst, that is for sure. The first person in line to parasite of of is her mother. But don't feel bad for the mother, as she has spent the last decade or so being an additional parasite on my brother-in-law. The apple didn't fall far from the tree.

Hiroku > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
03/02/2015 at 09:56

And Justin Bieber playing on an infinite loop on the background?

Snuze: Needs another Swede > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 09:59

Thats good. Wishing him, and your whole family, all the best.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Hiroku
03/02/2015 at 10:00

Maliciously. ;)

shop-teacher > NotUnlessRoundIsFunny
03/02/2015 at 10:00

Hey, at least something good came out of this :)

shop-teacher > Coty
03/02/2015 at 10:02

This dealership is known for this kind of BS. She knew that, and went anyways. In your guestimation, how much do you think they took her for?

Hiroku > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:02

That was a pretty huge flag right there.

These stories are the reason I want nothing to do with marriage myself. I got a swedish girl in my life which drains enough of my money as it is, but at least she doesn't get to keep half of my stuff when I dump her!

Coty > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:02

Oh I have no idea. I don't even do pricing.

shop-teacher > Party_in_the_USA
03/02/2015 at 10:02

Yes, they are the real victims here.

shop-teacher > bob and john
03/02/2015 at 10:03

Appropriate!

shop-teacher > Coty
03/02/2015 at 10:04

Dang.

yamahog > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:05

Yea, I'm just glad she has plenty of great colleges to choose from and she'll be able to GTFO from our mom's house and her shitty father's hometown. I only wish my mother had divorced that sad excuse for a man earlier.

Coty > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:06

Yeah, sorry bud.

MrPseudonym > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:07

Kia Sedonas are shit. I know, my mom had one. Thank god she sold it, she got a nice Ford Focus SE (yes she should've gotten the Titanium Manual or the ST, shut up, I know, she knows it too: "The only thing this car needs is a manual, and the Titanium gets better gas mileage."

shop-teacher > Hiroku
03/02/2015 at 10:08

I'm a fan of marriage, when it's the right person. But it's not for everybody, and you damn well better be sure it's the right person!

superhappyfuntime > jariten1781
03/02/2015 at 10:13

This. I was married to one too. They always have their next meal ticket lined up.

superhappyfuntime > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:15

As is usually the case. One red flag I ignored was that my ex's mom and both her sisters had been divorced multiple times. It cost me dearly. Like you said, you have to be committed to ridiculous levels of denial.

shop-teacher > Coty
03/02/2015 at 10:18

No worries!

shop-teacher > Snuze: Needs another Swede
03/02/2015 at 10:19

Thanks!

shop-teacher > superhappyfuntime
03/02/2015 at 10:24

Had to learn the hard way, eh? Glad you came through it!

jariten1781 > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:25

Let me hazard a guess....Mom's on disability.

My father in law is one of these leaches. The best thing to happen to my wife (other than meeting me heh heh) was when the MIL divorced his sorry ass when the kids were still in elementary school. She's a piece of work, but she definitely cared for her kids...he's just an unmitigated piece of shit.

After getting fired from over 15 places (he was an RN) the board finally yanked his license. He was constantly stealing prescription drugs, medical supplies, and even food and reselling it. At that point he randomly developed a back disability and is on the dole now. He lives in his parents house which he inherited, paid nothing on, declared bankruptcy, then used the homestead exemption to put the remaining mortgage and all property tax on perpetual hold. He made noise a year or so ago about moving in with us since apparently he's pissed some folks off and doesn't feel safe at home. Told him in no uncertain terms that if he even moved into our state he would never hear a single word from us ever again, that I'd consider it an aggressive action and he'd be as good as dead to us. Hasn't mentioned it since but apparently has been plying my sister in law who has a bigger heart than me for the same sort of setup.

ArmadaExpress drives a turbo outback > Hiroku
03/02/2015 at 10:27

Kinja'd!!!

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:39

If he's your brother-in-law, doesn't that mean that you're saying your sister is Satan's Idiot Spawn?

Also I predict in 3 years, she'll just lease another vehicle and make yet another bad decision. But at least from now on, she alone has to bear the burden of bad financial decisions.

The only way people like that ever learn is if *they* decide one day that they have to be better with their money. You can't tell them what to do or they go all 'Jezebel' on you.

And some people *never* learn.

Age is not a very good indicator of maturity.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > 505Turbeaux
03/02/2015 at 10:43

Yep... your mom definitely is smart. I'm a father and one of the LAST cars I'd want my kids to have has their first car is a 911.

Of course I can understand how you'd want to be your first car.

:-)

Mattbob > Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell.
03/02/2015 at 10:50

just reading that makes me unnecessarily angry. I just don't understand people.

thebigbossyboss > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:54

I am glad your brother is free. I feel the same way as he does. My ex was also financially irresponsible.

superhappyfuntime > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 10:56

Tell your brother to hang in there, it gets better.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 11:06

Well when I look at Kia.com under their special offers, they have the LX model selling for $28,300.... with a leasing deal of $289 over 36 months. So I'm betting she's getting hosed around $4000 on the MSRP... which causes leas payments of $355 vs $289, and 42 months vs 36 months. And note that it's even worse since that $289 lease payment is for when you only put $2000. So I suspect she's getting hosed on the finance rate. Let's say that's at least another $1000

A 2008 Sienna with high mileage and no warranty will go for at least $8000... but as much as $20,000 with low mileage based on what I see on Autotrader. So let's say she probably could have sold it privately for at least $12,000... meaning she got hosed at least another $3000... which also contributes to the extra/higher lease payments.

Then it's another $2000 ripoff with BS fees.

So I'd say she got hosed to the tune of at least $10,000.

shop-teacher > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly
03/02/2015 at 11:12

Daaaammmmmnnnnnnnnnn! Even if we cut that in half, that's still a hell of a beating!

shop-teacher > superhappyfuntime
03/02/2015 at 11:14

Will do! :)

shop-teacher > jariten1781
03/02/2015 at 11:24

No, she's not on disability, but she certainly isn't above that.

She's been living rent free in Jimmy's house for more than a decade. She's been working most of that time, but has never contributed a dime to the household. Eats their food, steals it and their silverware, and brings it to her deadbeat boyfriend's house, stuff like that.

She had cancer a couple years ago, and racked up about $40k in medical bills, which she has chosen not to pay. I say chosen, because instead she's spent tens of thousands on multiple vacations all over the world in the last few years. She still has enough money to pay the medical bills, but instead is buying a townhouse, and is currently filling our paperwork for different charities, to try and get them to pay her medical bills. I just hope those charities do some actual investigating into the financial background of those asking for help, because she doesn't deserve a single cent in aid.

Jimmy's soon to be ex will end up living with her mom in that townhouse. At least until the mom inevitably loses that. Jimmy said, "I give her five years before the bank kicks her out."

shop-teacher > ArmadaExpress drives a turbo outback
03/02/2015 at 11:26

She isn't hot, she's a walking hemorrhoid. And there isn't enough hot in the WORLD ...

shop-teacher > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly
03/02/2015 at 11:30

No, Jimmy is my wife's brother.

I don't think she'll have enough credit in 3 years to lease another vehicle. Her credit is already bad, and it's about to get a LOT worse. I predict her credit score in 42 months will be somewhere in the 300 range. I see a buy here, pay here lot in her future.

And you're right, she will never learn. I'm not the least bit surprised by her actions.

shop-teacher > shitheelandtoe
03/02/2015 at 11:33

Ha!

No, the person she claims is their father (they're twins), is a bouncer at a strip club. Or maybe he's the drug dealer, I can't keep track of them all. Without going into too much detail, I'm not convinced that those twins even have the same father (yes, that IS possible!)

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 11:48

Well that's a relief that you're not related to her by blood.

As for her credit... don't worry... she'll go to one of those "No credit, no problem" dealers... LOL

shop-teacher > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly
03/02/2015 at 11:55

Tell me about it! *shudder*

I am wasting zero shits worrying about her future :)

NotUnlessRoundIsFunny > shop-teacher
03/02/2015 at 12:03

Indeed, and thanks for taking my jerky comment as it was intended. :-)

On a more serious note though, my heart genuinely goes out to those kids and your brother in law. Hopefully the children will be able to rise above these circumstances and find peace and happiness. Having you as an uncle will help!

Twingo Tamer - About to descend into project car hell. > Mattbob
03/02/2015 at 12:28

Some people romanticise their relationship in their head so it appears to them better than it actually is. I dont necessarily blame him but he was a complete dick about the whole process.

shop-teacher > NotUnlessRoundIsFunny
03/02/2015 at 13:45

Gotta have humor, or the world can crush you!

Thanks! The family will do everything we can for my brother in law, and especially those kids. They have a rough road ahead of them, but at least they have one sane and stable parent.

kanadanmajava1 > shop-teacher
01/15/2016 at 10:37

“She bought rust-proofing on a car she was leasing!”

At this point I thought that she might actually be a good person in some way. Even horrible cars deserve some rust proofing.

PotbellyJoe and 42 others > shop-teacher
01/15/2016 at 10:39

Wow, and the ‘08 Sienna was a year that got the 3.5L in the good body. That car would last for another decade. Also any money into a lease is stupid (GAP coverage is required by law in most states) so now what happens if she totals the thing in a week? She’ll be out everything thanks to depreciation and the value of her add-ons won’t be reflected in the insurance valuation.

She’s screwed. Wow, what a terrible decision.

shop-teacher > kanadanmajava1
01/15/2016 at 10:41

No. She’s a horrible person. She now spends her free time cat-fishing dudes trying to get money out of them.

kanadanmajava1 > shop-teacher
01/15/2016 at 10:54

Am I impolite if I say that this method slightly resembles one profession that has quite long name and it starts with p?

Alfalfa > shop-teacher
01/15/2016 at 10:57

Damn. I just feel really bad for those kids, especially the 2 younger ones.

shop-teacher > kanadanmajava1
01/15/2016 at 11:12

As much as she gives it away, she’d actually be a lot smarter if she charged for it.

shop-teacher > Alfalfa
01/15/2016 at 11:18

Yes, the kids are the real victims in all of this. Especially the younger ones, and especially the boy of the younger ones. Jimmy does take care of and visit the other two some, but on weekends where just the older two are with him, the ex’s mom will take the girl to her house, but won’t take the boy because he’s special needs. The boy spent Thanksgiving with just his Mom, and she couldn’t be bothered to make any kind of special dinner even. It broke my heart when I heard about that.

ly2v8-Brian > shop-teacher
01/15/2016 at 11:46

Kinja'd!!!

nerd_racing > thebigbossyboss
01/15/2016 at 11:49

I’m pretty sure he said brother in law, meaning his sibling is the evil one?

nerd_racing > shop-teacher
01/15/2016 at 11:50

Kinja'd!!!

So wait, you are siding with your brother in law here? Sounds a lot like my situation with my older sister a while back. Poor guy reconciled with her though...

ly2v8-Brian > shop-teacher
01/15/2016 at 11:55

Oh well hopefully Jimmy at least can get custody of his kids.